sweet chestnut trees dying

[woodmonkey]

Hi All, I am in the process of purchasing a 4 acre woodland and one thing I have noticed with it is about a dozen of the 60 odd large sweet chestnuts are dead or dying from something, I have attached some photos and am after some advice please. Many thanks!

Oh yeah and my blog on the wood is here http://1000months.blogspot.co.uk

[woodmonkey]

and a couple more pics, maybe the trees are just dying from old age?

[splodger]

few q's
did you peel the bark off - or is that how they are at present?
is there any life in the tree at all - shoots up trunk etc or on a few branches / tops?
is there any root disturbance / movement?
any insect holes in trunk at all?

i ask last q. because we have had a couple of old s.chestnuts die over the last few years - none have that bark damage btw - we are convinced that ours have been killed off by an insect (similar to wood wasp) as the dead trees have had very noticeable albeit small bore holes around the trunks - just like a boring wasp would make - and all of our "hit" trees have been very old / our queen trees

[woodmonkey]

Thanks for the replies so far, to answer splodger's questions

1. No peeling that's how I found them
2. No life left at all
3. No root disturbance as far as I remember
4. Insect holes - Hmm I need to look closer with this in mind next time, but again I think it's a no.

With them all the answers as 'no' it could be that maybe they are just dead old trees, but then is it odd for 12 out of 60 trees to all look like this at the same time? I am wondering if its a good idea to turn them into firewood logs incase they are infectious? If not I kinda like the look of the odd dead tree in the wood.

Thanks for all your help

[Rich]

I notice Deer are very partial to Sweet chestnut and Willow shoots, less so to Hazel and Ash.

That's strange because we have a high density of deer in the High Weald and I would say that Hazel and Ash, along with oak are their first choice fodder, if young coppice shoots of these are in a cant they will usually leave the chestnut alone. Way down at the bottom of their list of favourite snacks is Alder which for some reason, they won't touch.

[splodger]

maybe they are just dead old trees, but then is it odd for 12 out of 60 trees to all look like this at the same time? I am wondering if its a good idea to turn them into firewood logs incase they are infectious? If not I kinda like the look of the odd dead tree in the wood.

do you know how long the trees have been "dead" - some of them could have been stood there with no life in them for years - i'd be more concerned if they all died off at the same and only recently

you said you were in the process of purchasing the woodland - if i was you i would try and have a chat with the seller to get a bit more info on when the trees started to deteriorate etc

as for using the timber - they would probably only be of firewood quality - as they are dead - they could be pretty well seasoned already so would probably burn in a woodburner straight away - or certainly take less seasoning than fresh cut green chestnut, which can take 3 or 4 years to dry out ready for burning

as they are big trees - i would be tempted not to leave them as dead wood standing but to fell them - if there is no life (in the roots) they could blow over at anytime and this could be very problematic / dangerous

also if they have died from a disease of some kind - you wouldn't want them to stay - best to remove

[woodmonkey]

thanks again for your advices, the comments have eased my concerns somewhat and I will follow the recommendations people have made. I would like to ask another question on rhododendrum clearance and will start another thread for it, thanks again for the help on this one.

Tom

[Toby Allen]

Where is the woodland ?

Could be honey fungus from deer damage like the chap said. Could be bacterial stem canker, or the 'mountain' shaped dark patch could be one of the Phytophoras affecting the older stressed trees. If they are singled stems that is likely the stress that started it.

Hard to say from a photo.

I hope you washed your boots before leaving....

[Stephen1]

It looks like a phytophthora that's killing the sweet chestnut - I can't tell which one from the pictures above. It may be one of the long established phytophthoras like 'ink disease' which wouldn't be too bad, as the rate of spread between mature trees can be realtively slow - unless you're on very poorly drained clay.

If it's one of the more recently arrived phytophthoras then perhaps you'll have to take this seriously. If this second scenario is the case then rhododendron is half the problem - as it facillitates it's spread. (These novel phytophthoras sporrulate at a high rate on rhododendron and consequently nearby trees are challenged by large numbers of spore and so are more likely to sucumb to the infection than would otherwise be the case - control of the rhodoendron will be key) Speak to your local F.C. officer, but be aware that they aren't typically experts in tree disease - unfortunately the people you would normally speak to about this are up to their eyes with the current Ash problem.

I may be able to help more if you can tell me about the soil type and drainage you have, and if you can post more pictures of trees that have more recently been affected. Do any large stems that are dying have apparently healthy younger stem growing from near their base - post a picture. Could you also photograph a recently affected tree with the outer bark removed to reveal the shape of the lesion from the base.

If it's ink disease then don't be too down hearted - I've had a similar situation, and from a conservation point of view (assuming you have a variety of tree species) it offers some advantages. If you google Ink disease most sites will talk about the inky exudate - it's important to note that despite the name this exudate isn't always produced, and if produced it may not be produced for long - so the inky exudate itself isn't key to the diagnosis.

It's true that grey squirel are big bark strippers of sweet chestnut. You can tell that this problem hasn't been caused by grey squirrel by the abscence of callusing around the edge of the lesion. Sweet chestnut is one of the most vigourous wound healers - with callus tissue layed down very quickly where you have physical damage (such as that made by a grey squirrels teeth). In this situation though you have an advancing front of tissue being killed by the infection, and so the response of rapid callus formation isn't possible in the same way.

You will probably find some squirrel damage on younger sweet chestnut in your wood, and you'll be able to see this callusing very clearly within less than a season of the damage being done. Of course to 'kill' the main stem a squirrel would have to girdle the tree by removing bark from a continous circle around the whole of the stem - if this were to happen you would then see a very vigourous sprouting of new shoots from the base of the stem growing at astonishing rate using the vast reserves of sugar that would be present in the healthy undamaged roots. None of this is consistent with the photos you've posted, and grey squirrel as the cause of this situation can be ruled out.

[Stephen1]

See section on 'Sweet Chestnut- pests and diseases ' on following link; (I rest my case)

Sorry to, as always, be disagreeing with you OCP - But congratulations on reaching 100 posts in record time for the forum!